Source code protection

[Robin]

kikito, your long (interesting) post makes the same mistake as many others (like this topic's title): confusing closed and hidden source.

Your point kind of depend on that confusion, which I think weakens your argument.

But few gamers are programmers, and whenever I see these discussions I feel like we forget that.

How many non-programmers are even interested in reading code, though?

[slime]

I have no suggestion to add which other members have not already described. But I simply want to point out an obversation that when I see these threads so many people dismiss hiding/obfuscating code because it’s not hard for programmers to get around. But few gamers are programmers, and whenever I see these discussions I feel like we forget that.

Well, non-programmers don't have much use for source code (aside from tinkering and learning.) If you're worried about piracy, it's kind of orthogonal to source code access.

[kikito]

kikito, your long (interesting) post makes the same mistake as many others (like this topic's title): confusing closed and hidden source.

Your point kind of depend on that confusion, which I think weakens your argument.

I know the difference between closed and hidden source. I didn't think it was particularly relevant to this discussion; the post, as you said, was long enough. Why do you think making the difference is relevant?

[Jasoco]

1. Run luac (bundled with the Lua interpreter your LÖVE is linked to) on your game files

Is there a luac bundled/available for all three platforms so that a compiled version could be made for each OS when the time comes? If so then there should be no real problem with wanting to release a "safe" version of a game as long as everyone can play it. After all, Löve is cross-platform and there's nothing worse (relatively) than a program being designed on a cross-platform system that's forced to only work on one system. It's just plain rude to the other people who don't use your OS.

Anyways, I always figured the whole point of Löve being based on Lua was to not only be easy to use and code but also easy to share and help others be able to program the same thing when they need to by allowing them to see different methods and help them figure out why their version doesn't work and what you did differently to make the same thing work correctly.

But if you want to make your final game locked from prying eyes, go ahead. As long as the game is fun. But remember, people will come knocking on your door with questions about how you did this and that. Just look at Oysi's project. (We still never got to see his code.) I guess I can't talk since I've done plenty of small projects I've teased and then never made OTs for them, but if anyone ever asked me to see the code for something I've abandoned or shelved, I'll let them have it. (Providing its one I'm not still actively interested in developing in the case I might ever want to put up an OT for it. Otherwise I'll give them a trimmed down demo that shows what they want to know how to do.)

[NightKawata]

I think we can all agree with a point made earlier in this topic: Even if you hide your code in the best way possible and it's impossible to obtain the source, you've still got another issue - someone could just ripoff your game and win that way. If your idea is good enough to rip off, it's going to be ripped off. Don't believe me? Take a look at something like Super Mario, or... I regret saying this, but Flappy Bird. Now, you could call it innovation (or just ripping off), but that's gonna happen.

You should focus more on making your game or software fun and a good time to use, not whether it's the world's most secure piece of work. If it CAN be broken, it WILL be broken. (PSN would like to agree with that)

I know there's a problem with source code protection (it's very easy to get the data from a LOVE project), but that's a common issue that spans all across the Seven Seas, and it's in the same category as piracy: There's no definitive way to stop it. It's just gonna happen.

In the long run, if you make something awesome in LOVE, people are going to love it because it's awesome. Not because it's well secured or the source is well hidden. The general public's not going to flip you off simply because you didn't protect your code with seven layers of Hell.

I'd say it's more of a side effect of using LOVE. At least it's not very difficult to make some pretty nifty stuff in it! Sure, the security and the ability to hide your code isn't perfect (but as we've mentioned, it's certainly possible), but when it's very easy to pick up and make something great?

I'm a bit biased on this because I do like to at least see how other people build their games, but hey.

now inb4 everybody bashes me for this post

[Azhukar]

And usually the response is something like: "why would you want to do that?"

I think it's clear that these types of responses are not helpful at all.

Imagine you see a man banging his head against a wall, asking you for the best way to engage in this endeavor.

You can recommend him several types of protective head gear, or you can tell him to stop trying.

[adnzzzzZ]

I need further instructions. I can run luajit -b main.lua but I don't know what to use for the output file. I've tried several different formats but they all don't work when I try to run the game. It gives me the "No code to run" error telling me to make sure main.lua is at the top level of the zip.

[ejmr]

Well, non-programmers don't have much use for source code (aside from tinkering and learning.) If you're worried about piracy, it's kind of orthogonal to source code access.

I never said anything about piracy. As you say yourself, it’s orthogonal to source code access. My main point, which I didn’t express well, is that when someone asks how to hide their code, as a community we immediately try to shoot down the idea and dissuade the person as best as possible.

That said, there’s been great advice so far in this thread, so thanks everyone for that.

Edit: Considering the prevalent opining about not hiding source or it being a waste of time, I am in favor of kikito’s idea of making it clear that LÖVE is for open-source projects only.

[adnzzzzZ]

Also, please stay on topic. This is not a thread for discussion of what LÖVE is or isn't, the benefits of open-source software, if the community should or shouldn't support this, if the people who want to do this are stupid, if there's no point in doing this because people will just break it anyway, etc. It's a thread for discussion of the ways to achieve what I outlined in the opening post. Thanks everyone who contributed so far!

With that said, it seems most people agree with the luajit solution, so:

I need further instructions. I can run luajit -b main.lua but I don't know what to use for the output file. I've tried several different formats but they all don't work when I try to run the game. It gives me the "No code to run" error telling me to make sure main.lua is at the top level of the zip.

Here's a gif describing my process:

[Azhukar]

LÖVE is for open-source projects only.

But it's not.

Also, please stay on topic. This is not a thread for discussion of what LÖVE is or isn't, the benefits of open-source software, if the community should or shouldn't support this

Did you forget what you wrote as the first post? You can't call out people for what you disagree with in your first post and simultaneously not make it about that.